<?xml version="1.0" encoding="UTF-8"?>
<feed xmlns="http://www.w3.org/2005/Atom">
  <updated></updated>
  <generator>https://nostr.ae</generator>

  <title>Nostr notes by </title>
  <author>
    <name></name>
  </author>
  <link rel="self" type="application/atom+xml" href="https://nostr.ae/npub164d4d9z50r3uzguvlmvwdsevs5t7w6y5hjfz72wkafp0wn72nvfq5znx9p.rss" />
  <link href="https://nostr.ae/npub164d4d9z50r3uzguvlmvwdsevs5t7w6y5hjfz72wkafp0wn72nvfq5znx9p" />
  <id>https://nostr.ae/npub164d4d9z50r3uzguvlmvwdsevs5t7w6y5hjfz72wkafp0wn72nvfq5znx9p</id>
  <icon></icon>
  <logo></logo>




  <entry>
    <id>https://nostr.ae/nevent1qqs8350uwj7huwe9wkldcl0h2lk0chgkz005940faqd7kxstv88lf9gzyr24k45523uw8sfr3nld3ekr9jz30emgjj7fytef6m4y9a60e2d3yhxqv0z</id>
    
      <title type="html">📅 Original date posted:2017-11-02 📝 Original ...</title>
    
    <link rel="alternate" href="https://nostr.ae/nevent1qqs8350uwj7huwe9wkldcl0h2lk0chgkz005940faqd7kxstv88lf9gzyr24k45523uw8sfr3nld3ekr9jz30emgjj7fytef6m4y9a60e2d3yhxqv0z" />
    <content type="html">
      In reply to &lt;a href=&#39;/nevent1qqsdzvdvv6ty7jf6ej7qjfp080s3pdpul53glep5ze8wlr2x258qgkguwe7gd&#39;&gt;nevent1q…e7gd&lt;/a&gt;&lt;br/&gt;_________________________&lt;br/&gt;&lt;br/&gt;📅 Original date posted:2017-11-02&lt;br/&gt;📝 Original message:Whatever their failings from their previous code or their adversarial&lt;br/&gt;nature, they got this code right and I&amp;#39;m only presenting it as a real and&lt;br/&gt;excellent solution for the impending threat to bitcoin. As a big core fan,&lt;br/&gt;I really wanted to delete the word Cash from my post because I was afraid&lt;br/&gt;someone would turn this technical discussion into a political football.&lt;br/&gt;&lt;br/&gt;On Nov 2, 2017 7:37 PM, &amp;#34;Gregory Maxwell&amp;#34; &amp;lt;greg at xiph.org&amp;gt; wrote:&lt;br/&gt;&lt;br/&gt;On Thu, Nov 2, 2017 at 11:31 PM, Scott Roberts via bitcoin-dev&lt;br/&gt;&amp;lt;bitcoin-dev at lists.linuxfoundation.org&amp;gt; wrote:&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt; Bitcoin cash will hard fork on Nov 13 to implement a new difficulty&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt; algorithm.  Bitcoin itself might need to hard fork to employ a similar&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt; algorithm. It&amp;#39;s about as good as they come because it followed the&lt;br/&gt;&lt;br/&gt;This is the bitcoin development mailing list, not the &amp;#34;give free&lt;br/&gt;review to the obviously defective proposals of adversarial competing&lt;br/&gt;systems&amp;#34; mailing list. Your posting is off-topic.&lt;br/&gt;-------------- next part --------------&lt;br/&gt;An HTML attachment was scrubbed...&lt;br/&gt;URL: &amp;lt;&lt;a href=&#34;http://lists.linuxfoundation.org/pipermail/bitcoin-dev/attachments/20171102/64dbe338/attachment.html&amp;gt&#34;&gt;http://lists.linuxfoundation.org/pipermail/bitcoin-dev/attachments/20171102/64dbe338/attachment.html&amp;gt&lt;/a&gt;;
    </content>
    <updated>2023-06-07T18:07:31Z</updated>
  </entry>

  <entry>
    <id>https://nostr.ae/nevent1qqsgkajyr6azyhrxt7a5adq3tllu8a6pz4e0w6n58etal5gdmr3vsngzyr24k45523uw8sfr3nld3ekr9jz30emgjj7fytef6m4y9a60e2d3ywjmm35</id>
    
      <title type="html">📅 Original date posted:2017-11-02 📝 Original ...</title>
    
    <link rel="alternate" href="https://nostr.ae/nevent1qqsgkajyr6azyhrxt7a5adq3tllu8a6pz4e0w6n58etal5gdmr3vsngzyr24k45523uw8sfr3nld3ekr9jz30emgjj7fytef6m4y9a60e2d3ywjmm35" />
    <content type="html">
      In reply to &lt;a href=&#39;/nevent1qqsznvv2n57eft3d7fs528f4etkk4d0wdu4t8lplzum8t9veccs77ysuj398f&#39;&gt;nevent1q…398f&lt;/a&gt;&lt;br/&gt;_________________________&lt;br/&gt;&lt;br/&gt;📅 Original date posted:2017-11-02&lt;br/&gt;📝 Original message:Bitcoin cash will hard fork on Nov 13 to implement a new difficulty&lt;br/&gt;algorithm.  Bitcoin itself might need to hard fork to employ a similar&lt;br/&gt;algorithm. It&amp;#39;s about as good as they come because it followed the&lt;br/&gt;&amp;#34;simplest is best&amp;#34; route. Their averaging window is probably&lt;br/&gt;significantly too long (N=144). It&amp;#39;s:&lt;br/&gt;&lt;br/&gt;next_D = sum (past 144 D&amp;#39;s) * T / sum(past 144 solvetimes)&lt;br/&gt;&lt;br/&gt;They correctly did not use max(timestamp) - min(timestamp) in the&lt;br/&gt;denominator like others do.&lt;br/&gt;&lt;br/&gt;They&amp;#39;ve written the code and they&amp;#39;re about to use it live, so Bitcoin&lt;br/&gt;will have a clear, simple, and tested path if it suddenly needs to&lt;br/&gt;hard fork due to having 20x delays for the next 2000 blocks (taking it&lt;br/&gt;a year to get unstuck).&lt;br/&gt;&lt;br/&gt;Details on it and the decision process:&lt;br/&gt;&lt;a href=&#34;https://www.bitcoinabc.org/november&#34;&gt;https://www.bitcoinabc.org/november&lt;/a&gt;&lt;br/&gt;&lt;br/&gt;It uses a nice median of 3 for the beginning and end of the window to&lt;br/&gt;help alleviate bad timestamp problems. It&amp;#39;s nice, helps a little, but&lt;br/&gt;will also slow its response by 1 block.  They also have 2x and 1/2&lt;br/&gt;limits on the adjustment per block, which is a lot more than they will&lt;br/&gt;ever need.&lt;br/&gt;&lt;br/&gt;I recommend bitcoin consider using it and making it N=50 instead of 144.&lt;br/&gt;&lt;br/&gt;I have seen that any attempts to modify the above with things like a&lt;br/&gt;low pass filter, starting the window at MTP, or preventing negative&lt;br/&gt;timestamps will only reduce its effectiveness. Bitcoin&amp;#39;s &#43;12 and -6&lt;br/&gt;limits on the timestamps are sufficient and well chosen, although&lt;br/&gt;something a bit smaller than the &#43;12 might have been better.&lt;br/&gt;&lt;br/&gt;One of the contenders to the above is new and actually better, devised&lt;br/&gt;by Degnr8 and they call it D622 or wt-144.It&amp;#39;s a little better than&lt;br/&gt;they realize. It&amp;#39;s the only real improvement in difficulty algorithms&lt;br/&gt;since the rolling average.  It gives a linearly higher weight to the&lt;br/&gt;more recent timestamps. Otherwise it is the same. Others have probably&lt;br/&gt;come across it, but there is too much noise in difficulty algorithms&lt;br/&gt;to find the good ones.&lt;br/&gt;&lt;br/&gt;# Degnr8&amp;#39;s D622 difficulty algorithm&lt;br/&gt;# T=TargetTime, S=Solvetime&lt;br/&gt;# modified by zawy&lt;br/&gt;for i = 1 to N  (from oldest to most recent block)&lt;br/&gt;    t &#43;= T[i] / D[i] * i&lt;br/&gt;    j &#43;= i&lt;br/&gt;next i&lt;br/&gt;next_D = j / t * T&lt;br/&gt;&lt;br/&gt;I believe any modification to the above strict mathematical weighted&lt;br/&gt;average will reduce it&amp;#39;s effectiveness. It does not oscillate anymore&lt;br/&gt;than regular algos and rises faster and drops faster, when needed.
    </content>
    <updated>2023-06-07T18:07:30Z</updated>
  </entry>

  <entry>
    <id>https://nostr.ae/nevent1qqs9lrsxwzuuupdp9hdhdse5nkq04rec3mz6z2afw3c5t57ett9za9gzyr24k45523uw8sfr3nld3ekr9jz30emgjj7fytef6m4y9a60e2d3y00kswx</id>
    
      <title type="html">📅 Original date posted:2017-10-13 📝 Original message:&amp;gt; ...</title>
    
    <link rel="alternate" href="https://nostr.ae/nevent1qqs9lrsxwzuuupdp9hdhdse5nkq04rec3mz6z2afw3c5t57ett9za9gzyr24k45523uw8sfr3nld3ekr9jz30emgjj7fytef6m4y9a60e2d3y00kswx" />
    <content type="html">
      In reply to &lt;a href=&#39;/nevent1qqsgece7sjcww4lv9h7ue6msnnlczrauu45xnvwx9ejk9jc08cwhjvqnrwrkm&#39;&gt;nevent1q…wrkm&lt;/a&gt;&lt;br/&gt;_________________________&lt;br/&gt;&lt;br/&gt;📅 Original date posted:2017-10-13&lt;br/&gt;📝 Original message:&amp;gt; ZmnSCPxj wrote&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; Mining infrastructure follows price.&lt;br/&gt;&lt;br/&gt;Ilansky wrote:&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt; In the case of bitcoin, it is the price that follows mining infrastructures.&lt;br/&gt;&lt;br/&gt;I generally agree with ZmnSCPxj that&lt;br/&gt;good ideas =&amp;gt; good devs =&amp;gt; hodlers =&amp;gt; price =&amp;gt; mining&lt;br/&gt;&lt;br/&gt;Except that each step is not an absolute, and can be biased by things&lt;br/&gt;like miners who seek profit via fees and other means that are not good&lt;br/&gt;for everyone else. Llansky&amp;#39;s belief itself influences price away from&lt;br/&gt;the ideal. Marketing &amp;#34;easy profits for hodlers!&amp;#34; and first-to-market&lt;br/&gt;monopoly are other elements that influence price and thereby guide&lt;br/&gt;mining away from good ideas (like a constant value currency). Then&lt;br/&gt;price pulls in good devs that pulls in more mining. So it can snowball&lt;br/&gt;into a monster.&lt;br/&gt;&lt;br/&gt;We need not debate cause and effect since it&amp;#39;s distant from the list&amp;#39;s&lt;br/&gt;goals. The relevance to me is that the biases away from ZmnSCPxj&amp;#39;s&lt;br/&gt;ideal are a reason a more responsive difficulty is needed.&lt;br/&gt;&lt;br/&gt;Mining is for determining truth of the blockchain, not to make sure&lt;br/&gt;there is only 1 blockchain. ZmnSCPxj indicates we should not do&lt;br/&gt;anything that has more precision or speed in determining the correct&lt;br/&gt;difficulty if it reduces Bitcoin&amp;#39;s ability to be a monopoly. Not&lt;br/&gt;coincidentally, the monopoly helps ensure hodlers become the new 1%. A&lt;br/&gt;fork clone that uses the faster difficulty would attack BTC&amp;#39;s slow&lt;br/&gt;difficulty if it achieves a comparable price. All other things being&lt;br/&gt;equal, it would lower BTC&amp;#39;s value until it forks to fix the&lt;br/&gt;difficulty.&lt;br/&gt;&lt;br/&gt;On Fri, Oct 13, 2017 at 8:27 AM, Ilan Oh via bitcoin-dev&lt;br/&gt;&amp;lt;bitcoin-dev at lists.linuxfoundation.org&amp;gt; wrote:&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; Mining infrastructure follows price.  If bitcoins were still trading at 1&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; USD per coin, nobody will build mining infrastructure to the same level as&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; today, with 5000 USD per coin.&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt; In the case of bitcoin, it is the price that follows mining infrastructures.&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt; The price is at 5000 because it is difficult to mine bitcoin not the other&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt; way around, like you mention it. Even with a fixed demand, price would go up&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt; as difficulty grow, the supply guide the market. There is a strong incentive&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt; to mine blindly as it is difficult to estimate for a miner where is the&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt; actual demand, with a start up currency without actual economic support.&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt; Indeed at the genesis of this &amp;#34;mining-price&amp;#34; cycle the incentive was to&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt; contribute to a network and create ones own supply, and not respond to a&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt; demand.&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt; Ilansky&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt; Le 13 oct. 2017 13:55, &amp;lt;bitcoin-dev-request at lists.linuxfoundation.org&amp;gt; a&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt; écrit :&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt;&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; Send bitcoin-dev mailing list submissions to&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt;         bitcoin-dev at lists.linuxfoundation.org&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt;&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt;         &lt;a href=&#34;https://lists.linuxfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/bitcoin-dev&#34;&gt;https://lists.linuxfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/bitcoin-dev&lt;/a&gt;&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; or, via email, send a message with subject or body &amp;#39;help&amp;#39; to&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt;         bitcoin-dev-request at lists.linuxfoundation.org&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt;&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; You can reach the person managing the list at&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt;         bitcoin-dev-owner at lists.linuxfoundation.org&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt;&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; than &amp;#34;Re: Contents of bitcoin-dev digest...&amp;#34;&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt;&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt;&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; Today&amp;#39;s Topics:&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt;&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt;    1. Re: New difficulty algorithm part 2 (ZmnSCPxj)&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt;    2. Re: New difficulty algorithm part 2 (Scott Roberts)&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt;&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt;&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; ----------------------------------------------------------------------&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt;&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; Message: 1&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; Date: Fri, 13 Oct 2017 00:45:33 -0400&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; From: ZmnSCPxj &amp;lt;ZmnSCPxj at protonmail.com&amp;gt;&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; To: Scott Roberts &amp;lt;wordsgalore at gmail.com&amp;gt;&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; Cc: &amp;#34;bitcoin-dev at lists.linuxfoundation.org&amp;#34;&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt;         &amp;lt;bitcoin-dev at lists.linuxfoundation.org&amp;gt;&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; Subject: Re: [bitcoin-dev] New difficulty algorithm part 2&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; Message-ID:&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt;&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;lt;Hr8ORNHzR76wNhJHoagwXi2ewQ1qYSZScH0xeltVnqid2ljOowc2bj8-rkbdukpk9eyoPx1ReOZSUsNrcowRU9gL5UbKtblkQn2SUo06BHE=@protonmail.com&amp;gt;&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt;&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; Content-Type: text/plain; charset=&amp;#34;utf-8&amp;#34;&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt;&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; Good morning,&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt;&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt;ZmnSCPxj wrote:&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt;&amp;gt; Thus even if the unwanted chain provides 2 tokens as fee per block,&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt;&amp;gt; whereas the wanted chain provides 1 token as fee per block, if the&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt;&amp;gt; unwanted chain tokens are valued at 1/4 the wanted chain tokens, miners&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt;&amp;gt; will still prefer the wanted chain regardless.&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt;&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt;This is a good point I was not thinking about, but your math assumes&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt;1/2 price for a coin that can do 2x more transactions. Holders like&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt;Roger Ver have an interest in low price and more transactions. A coin&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt;with 2x more transactions, 22% lower price, and 22% lower fees per&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt;coin transferred will attract more merchants, customers, and miners&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt;(they get 50% more total fees) and this will in turn attract more&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt;hodlers and devs. This assumes it outweighs hodler security concerns.&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt;Merchants and customers, to the extent they are not long term hodlers,&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt;are not interested in price as much as stability, so they are somewhat&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt;at odds with hodlers.&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt;&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; As of this moment, BT1 / BT2 price ratio in BitFinex is slightly higher&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; than 7 : 1.  Twice the transaction rate cannot overcome this price ratio&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; difference.  Even if you were to claim that the BitFinex data is off by a&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; factor of 3, twice the transaction rate still cannot overcome the price&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; ratio difference.  Do you have stronger data than what is available on&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; BitFinex?  If not, your assumptions are incorrect and all conclusions&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; suspect.&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt;&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt;Bitcoin consensus truth is based on &amp;#34;might is right&amp;#34;. Buyers and&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt;sellers of goods and services (&amp;#34;users&amp;#34;) can shift some might to miners&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt;via fees, to the chagrin of hodlers who have more interest in security&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt;and price increases. Some hodlers think meeting user needs is the&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt;source of long term value. Others think mining infrastructure is.&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt;&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; Mining infrastructure follows price.  If bitcoins were still trading at 1&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; USD per coin, nobody will build mining infrastructure to the same level as&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; today, with 5000 USD per coin.&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt;&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; Price will follow user needs, i.e. demand.&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt;&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt;You&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt;seem to require hodlers to correctly identify and rely solely on good&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt;developers.&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt;&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; For the very specific case of 2X, it is very easy to make this&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; identification.  Even without understanding the work being done, one can&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; reasonably say that it is far more likely that a loose group of 100 or more&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; developers will contain a few good or excellent developers, than a group of&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; a few developers containing a similar number of good or excellent&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; developers.&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt;&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; User needs will get met only on the chain that good developers work on.&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; Bitcoin today has too many limitations: viruses on Windows can steal all&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; your money, fee estimates consistently overestimate, fees rise during&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; spamming attacks, easy to lose psuedonymity, tiny UTXOs are infeasible to&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; spend, cannot support dozens of thousands of transactions per second.&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; Rationally, long-term hodlers will select a chain with better developers who&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; are more likely to discover or innovate methods to reduce, eliminate, or&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; sidestep those limitations.  Perhaps the balance will change in the future,&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; but it is certainly not the balance now, and thus any difficulty algorithm&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; change in response to the current situation will be premature, and far more&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; likely to cause disaster than avert one.&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt;&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt;Whatever combination of these is the case, bad money can&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt;still drive out good, especially if the market determination is not&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt;efficient.&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt;&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt;A faster measurement of hashrate for difficulty enables the economic&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt;determination to be more efficient and correct. It prevents the&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt;biggest coin from bullying forks that have better ideas. Conversely,&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt;it prevents miners from switching to an inferior coin simply because&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt;it provides them with more &amp;#34;protection money&amp;#34; from fees that enables&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt;them to bully Bitcoin Core out of existence, even in the presence of a&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt;slightly larger hodler support.&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt;&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; This requires that all chains follow the same difficulty adjustment: after&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; all, it is also entirely the possibility that 2X will be the lower-hashrate&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; coin in a few months, with the Core chain bullying them out of existence.&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; Perhaps you should cross-post your analysis to bitcoin-segwit2x also.  After&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; all, the 2X developers should also want to have faster price discovery of&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; the true price of 2X, away from the unfavorable (incorrect?) pricing on&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; BitFinex.&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt;&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt;Devs are a governing authority under the influence of users, hodlers,&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt;and miners. Miners are like banks lobbying government for higher total&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt;fees. Hodlers are the new 1%, holding 90% of the coin, lobbying both&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt;devs and users for security, but equally interested in price&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt;increases. Users are &amp;#34;the people&amp;#34; that devs need to protect against&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt;both hodlers and miners. They do not care about price as long as it is&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt;stable. They do not want to become the 99% owning 10% of the coin or&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt;have to pay unecessary fees merely for their coin to be the biggest&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt;bully on the block. A faster responding difficulty will take a lot of&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt;hot air out of the bully. It prevents miners from being able to&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt;dictate that only coins with high fees are allowed. They are less&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt;able to destroy small coins that have a fast defense.&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt;&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt;The 1% and banks would starve the people that feed them to death if&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt;they were allowed complete control of the government. Are hodlers and&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt;miners any wiser?&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt;&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; Are developers any wiser, either?&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt;&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; Then consider this wisdom: The fewer back-incompatible changes to a coin,&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; the better.  Hardforks of any kind are an invitation to disaster and, at&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; this point, require massive coordination effort which cannot be feasibly&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; done within a month.  Fast market determination can be done using off-chain&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; methods (such as on-exchange trades), and are generally robust against&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; temporary problems on-chain, although admittedly there is a counterparty&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; risk involved.  The coin works, and in general there is usually very little&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; need to fix it, especially using dangerous hardforks.&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt;&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt;Devs need to strive for an expansion of the coin&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt;quantity to keep value constant which is the foundation of the 5&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt;characteristics of an ideal currency.&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt;&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; Is that your goal?  This is a massive departure from the conception of&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; Bitcoin as having a fixed limit and effectively becoming deflationary.  It&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; will also lead to massive economic distortions in favor of those who receive&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; newly-minted coins.  I doubt any developer would want to have this property.&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt;&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; Regards,&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; ZmnSCPxj&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; -------------- next part --------------&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; An HTML attachment was scrubbed...&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; URL:&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;lt;&lt;a href=&#34;http://lists.linuxfoundation.org/pipermail/bitcoin-dev/attachments/20171013/1afdebf0/attachment.html&amp;gt&#34;&gt;http://lists.linuxfoundation.org/pipermail/bitcoin-dev/attachments/20171013/1afdebf0/attachment.html&amp;gt&lt;/a&gt;;&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt;&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; ------------------------------&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt;&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; Message: 2&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; Date: Fri, 13 Oct 2017 07:35:09 -0400&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; From: Scott Roberts &amp;lt;wordsgalore at gmail.com&amp;gt;&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; To: ZmnSCPxj &amp;lt;ZmnSCPxj at protonmail.com&amp;gt;&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; Cc: &amp;#34;bitcoin-dev at lists.linuxfoundation.org&amp;#34;&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt;         &amp;lt;bitcoin-dev at lists.linuxfoundation.org&amp;gt;&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; Subject: Re: [bitcoin-dev] New difficulty algorithm part 2&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; Message-ID:&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt;&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;lt;CADtTMvnrZp=JD4rkXQOZAPNS9BMNMqnTyfA65PRzZhWs&#43;VxgHA at mail.gmail.com&amp;gt;&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; Content-Type: text/plain; charset=&amp;#34;UTF-8&amp;#34;&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt;&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; Yes, the current price ratio indicates there is no need for a new&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; difficulty algorithm. I do not desire to fork before a disaster, or to&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; otherwise employ a new difficulty before a fork is otherwise needed.&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt;&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; A 2-week delay in difficulty response is a 2 week error in&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; measurement. Slow response generally means less intelligence.&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt;&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; My goal is not to have a bunch of BTC clones that merchants and buyers&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; use equally, but to have a  better difficulty algorithm in place to be&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; used in the next BTC &amp;#34;Core&amp;#34; fork. If not for the current situation,&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; then for future security.&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt;&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt;  This is a massive departure from the conception of Bitcoin as having a&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt; fixed limit and effectively becoming deflationary.&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt;&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; You mean multiple forks is inflationary. The current limit in quantity&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; is deflationary because the use of the coin is rising faster than its&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; mining is producing (see velocity of money). Constant value is defined&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; as being neither. Bitcoin&amp;#39;s deflationary quality created a massive&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; marketing advantage as well as paid the creator about million dollars&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; an hour. If it suddenly were able to be a constant value coin, its use&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; in the marketplace and as a real store of value would skyrocket and&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; the cries of &amp;#34;Ponzi scheme&amp;#34; would stop. The trick is in determining&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; constant value without a 3rd party such as an index of a basket of&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; commodities (which both Keynes and von Mises wanted, but was scuttled&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; by the U.S. at Bretton Woods).&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt;&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; On Fri, Oct 13, 2017 at 12:45 AM, ZmnSCPxj &amp;lt;ZmnSCPxj at protonmail.com&amp;gt;&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; wrote:&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt; Good morning,&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt;&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt;&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt;&amp;gt;ZmnSCPxj wrote:&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; Thus even if the unwanted chain provides 2 tokens as fee per block,&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; whereas the wanted chain provides 1 token as fee per block, if the&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; unwanted chain tokens are valued at 1/4 the wanted chain tokens,&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; miners&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; will still prefer the wanted chain regardless.&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt;&amp;gt;&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt;&amp;gt;This is a good point I was not thinking about, but your math assumes&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt;&amp;gt;1/2 price for a coin that can do 2x more transactions. Holders like&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt;&amp;gt;Roger Ver have an interest in low price and more transactions. A coin&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt;&amp;gt;with 2x more transactions, 22% lower price, and 22% lower fees per&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt;&amp;gt;coin transferred will attract more merchants, customers, and miners&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt;&amp;gt;(they get 50% more total fees) and this will in turn attract more&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt;&amp;gt;hodlers and devs. This assumes it outweighs hodler security concerns.&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt;&amp;gt;Merchants and customers, to the extent they are not long term hodlers,&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt;&amp;gt;are not interested in price as much as stability, so they are somewhat&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt;&amp;gt;at odds with hodlers.&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt;&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt; As of this moment, BT1 / BT2 price ratio in BitFinex is slightly higher&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt; than&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt; 7 : 1.  Twice the transaction rate cannot overcome this price ratio&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt; difference.  Even if you were to claim that the BitFinex data is off by&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt; a&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt; factor of 3, twice the transaction rate still cannot overcome the price&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt; ratio difference.  Do you have stronger data than what is available on&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt; BitFinex?  If not, your assumptions are incorrect and all conclusions&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt; suspect.&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt;&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt;&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt;&amp;gt;Bitcoin consensus truth is based on &amp;#34;might is right&amp;#34;. Buyers and&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt;&amp;gt;sellers of goods and services (&amp;#34;users&amp;#34;) can shift some might to miners&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt;&amp;gt;via fees, to the chagrin of hodlers who have more interest in security&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt;&amp;gt;and price increases. Some hodlers think meeting user needs is the&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt;&amp;gt;source of long term value. Others think mining infrastructure is.&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt;&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt; Mining infrastructure follows price.  If bitcoins were still trading at&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt; 1&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt; USD per coin, nobody will build mining infrastructure to the same level&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt; as&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt; today, with 5000 USD per coin.&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt;&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt; Price will follow user needs, i.e. demand.&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt;&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt;&amp;gt;You&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt;&amp;gt;seem to require hodlers to correctly identify and rely solely on good&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt;&amp;gt;developers.&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt;&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt; For the very specific case of 2X, it is very easy to make this&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt; identification.  Even without understanding the work being done, one can&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt; reasonably say that it is far more likely that a loose group of 100 or&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt; more&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt; developers will contain a few good or excellent developers, than a group&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt; of&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt; a few developers containing a similar number of good or excellent&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt; developers.&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt;&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt; User needs will get met only on the chain that good developers work on.&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt; Bitcoin today has too many limitations: viruses on Windows can steal all&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt; your money, fee estimates consistently overestimate, fees rise during&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt; spamming attacks, easy to lose psuedonymity, tiny UTXOs are infeasible&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt; to&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt; spend, cannot support dozens of thousands of transactions per second.&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt; Rationally, long-term hodlers will select a chain with better developers&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt; who&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt; are more likely to discover or innovate methods to reduce, eliminate, or&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt; sidestep those limitations.  Perhaps the balance will change in the&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt; future,&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt; but it is certainly not the balance now, and thus any difficulty&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt; algorithm&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt; change in response to the current situation will be premature, and far&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt; more&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt; likely to cause disaster than avert one.&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt;&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt;&amp;gt;Whatever combination of these is the case, bad money can&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt;&amp;gt;still drive out good, especially if the market determination is not&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt;&amp;gt;efficient.&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt;&amp;gt;&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt;&amp;gt;A faster measurement of hashrate for difficulty enables the economic&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt;&amp;gt;determination to be more efficient and correct. It prevents the&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt;&amp;gt;biggest coin from bullying forks that have better ideas. Conversely,&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt;&amp;gt;it prevents miners from switching to an inferior coin simply because&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt;&amp;gt;it provides them with more &amp;#34;protection money&amp;#34; from fees that enables&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt;&amp;gt;them to bully Bitcoin Core out of existence, even in the presence of a&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt;&amp;gt;slightly larger hodler support.&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt;&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt; This requires that all chains follow the same difficulty adjustment:&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt; after&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt; all, it is also entirely the possibility that 2X will be the&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt; lower-hashrate&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt; coin in a few months, with the Core chain bullying them out of&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt; existence.&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt; Perhaps you should cross-post your analysis to bitcoin-segwit2x also.&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt; After&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt; all, the 2X developers should also want to have faster price discovery&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt; of&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt; the true price of 2X, away from the unfavorable (incorrect?) pricing on&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt; BitFinex.&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt;&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt;&amp;gt;Devs are a governing authority under the influence of users, hodlers,&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt;&amp;gt;and miners. Miners are like banks lobbying government for higher total&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt;&amp;gt;fees. Hodlers are the new 1%, holding 90% of the coin, lobbying both&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt;&amp;gt;devs and users for security, but equally interested in price&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt;&amp;gt;increases. Users are &amp;#34;the people&amp;#34; that devs need to protect against&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt;&amp;gt;both hodlers and miners. They do not care about price as long as it is&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt;&amp;gt;stable. They do not want to become the 99% owning 10% of the coin or&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt;&amp;gt;have to pay unecessary fees merely for their coin to be the biggest&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt;&amp;gt;bully on the block. A faster responding difficulty will take a lot of&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt;&amp;gt;hot air out of the bully. It prevents miners from being able to&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt;&amp;gt;dictate that only coins with high fees are allowed. They are less&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt;&amp;gt;able to destroy small coins that have a fast defense.&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt;&amp;gt;&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt;&amp;gt;The 1% and banks would starve the people that feed them to death if&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt;&amp;gt;they were allowed complete control of the government. Are hodlers and&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt;&amp;gt;miners any wiser?&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt;&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt; Are developers any wiser, either?&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt;&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt; Then consider this wisdom: The fewer back-incompatible changes to a&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt; coin,&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt; the better.  Hardforks of any kind are an invitation to disaster and, at&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt; this point, require massive coordination effort which cannot be feasibly&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt; done within a month.  Fast market determination can be done using&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt; off-chain&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt; methods (such as on-exchange trades), and are generally robust against&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt; temporary problems on-chain, although admittedly there is a counterparty&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt; risk involved.  The coin works, and in general there is usually very&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt; little&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt; need to fix it, especially using dangerous hardforks.&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt;&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt;&amp;gt;Devs need to strive for an expansion of the coin&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt;&amp;gt;quantity to keep value constant which is the foundation of the 5&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt;&amp;gt;characteristics of an ideal currency.&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt;&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt; Is that your goal?  This is a massive departure from the conception of&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt; Bitcoin as having a fixed limit and effectively becoming deflationary.&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt; It&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt; will also lead to massive economic distortions in favor of those who&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt; receive&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt; newly-minted coins.  I doubt any developer would want to have this&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt; property.&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt;&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt; Regards,&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &amp;gt; ZmnSCPxj&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt;&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt;&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; ------------------------------&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt;&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; _______________________________________________&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; bitcoin-dev mailing list&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; bitcoin-dev at lists.linuxfoundation.org&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; &lt;a href=&#34;https://lists.linuxfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/bitcoin-dev&#34;&gt;https://lists.linuxfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/bitcoin-dev&lt;/a&gt;&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt;&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt;&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; End of bitcoin-dev Digest, Vol 29, Issue 21&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt; *******************************************&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt; _______________________________________________&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt; bitcoin-dev mailing list&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt; bitcoin-dev at lists.linuxfoundation.org&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt; &lt;a href=&#34;https://lists.linuxfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/bitcoin-dev&#34;&gt;https://lists.linuxfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/bitcoin-dev&lt;/a&gt;&lt;br/&gt;&amp;gt;
    </content>
    <updated>2023-06-07T18:07:09Z</updated>
  </entry>

  <entry>
    <id>https://nostr.ae/nevent1qqstkz8am36dnjlwdnl3gyvcgms5c69xw8xua6sqencz27nkyx972hgzyr24k45523uw8sfr3nld3ekr9jz30emgjj7fytef6m4y9a60e2d3ynfy6ru</id>
    
      <title type="html">📅 Original date posted:2017-10-09 📝 Original message:Sorry, ...</title>
    
    <link rel="alternate" href="https://nostr.ae/nevent1qqstkz8am36dnjlwdnl3gyvcgms5c69xw8xua6sqencz27nkyx972hgzyr24k45523uw8sfr3nld3ekr9jz30emgjj7fytef6m4y9a60e2d3ynfy6ru" />
    <content type="html">
      In reply to &lt;a href=&#39;/nevent1qqs8rp5je2t9yg5qgvsct29kuh7j5dfs8q5fqf9rmknwxypcvpkll8saul9ng&#39;&gt;nevent1q…l9ng&lt;/a&gt;&lt;br/&gt;_________________________&lt;br/&gt;&lt;br/&gt;📅 Original date posted:2017-10-09&lt;br/&gt;📝 Original message:Sorry, my previous email did not have the plain text I intended.&lt;br/&gt;&lt;br/&gt;Background: &lt;br/&gt;&lt;br/&gt;The bitcoin difficulty algorithm does not seem to be a good one. If there &lt;br/&gt;is a fork due to miners seeking maximum profit without due regard to &lt;br/&gt;security, users, and nodes, the &amp;#34;better&amp;#34; coin could end up being the &lt;br/&gt;minority chain. If 90% of hashrate is really going to at least initially go &lt;br/&gt;towards using SegWit2x, BTC would face 10x delays in confirmations &lt;br/&gt;until the next difficulty adjustment, negatively affecting its price relative &lt;br/&gt;to BTC1, causing further delays from even more miner abandonment &lt;br/&gt;(until the next adjustment). The 10% miners remaining on BTC do not &lt;br/&gt;inevitably lose by staying to endure 10x delays because they have 10x &lt;br/&gt;less competition, and the same situation applies to BTC1 miners. If the &lt;br/&gt;prices are the same and stable, all seems well for everyone, other things &lt;br/&gt;aside. But if the BTC price does not fall to reflect the decreased hashrate, &lt;br/&gt;he situation seems to be a big problem for both coins: BTC1 miners will &lt;br/&gt;jump back to BTC when the difficulty adjustment occurs, initiating a &lt;br/&gt;potentially never-ending oscillation between the two coins, potentially &lt;br/&gt;worse than what BCH is experiencing.  They will not issue coins too fast &lt;br/&gt;like BCH because that is a side effect of the asymmetry in BCH&amp;#39;s rise and &lt;br/&gt;fall algorithm. &lt;br/&gt;&lt;br/&gt;Solution: &lt;br/&gt;&lt;br/&gt;Hard fork to implement a new difficulty algorithm that uses a simple rolling &lt;br/&gt;average with a much smaller window.  Many small coins have done this as &lt;br/&gt;a way to stop big miners from coming on and then suddenly leaving, leaving &lt;br/&gt;constant miners stuck with a high difficulty for the rest of a (long) averaging &lt;br/&gt;window.  Even better, adjust the reward based on recent solvetimes to &lt;br/&gt;motivate more mining (or less) if the solvetimes are too slow (or too fast). &lt;br/&gt;This will keep keep coin issuance rate perfectly on schedule with real time. &lt;br/&gt;&lt;br/&gt;I recommend the following for Bitcoin, as fast, simple, and better than any &lt;br/&gt;other difficulty algorithm I&amp;#39;m aware of.  This is the result of a lot of work the &lt;br/&gt;past year. &lt;br/&gt;&lt;br/&gt;=== Begin difficulty algorithm === &lt;br/&gt;# Zawy v6 difficulty algorithm (modified for bitcoin) &lt;br/&gt;# Unmodified Zawy v6 for alt coins: &lt;br/&gt;# &lt;a href=&#34;http://zawy1.blogspot.com/2017/07/best-difficulty-algorithm-zawy-v1b.html&#34;&gt;http://zawy1.blogspot.com/2017/07/best-difficulty-algorithm-zawy-v1b.html&lt;/a&gt; &lt;br/&gt;# All my failed attempts at something better: &lt;br/&gt;# &lt;a href=&#34;https://github.com/seredat/karbowanec/commit/231db5270acb2e673a641a1800be910ce345668a&#34;&gt;https://github.com/seredat/karbowanec/commit/231db5270acb2e673a641a1800be910ce345668a&lt;/a&gt; &lt;br/&gt;# &lt;br/&gt;# Keep negative solvetimes to correct bad timestamps. &lt;br/&gt;# Do not be tempted to use: &lt;br/&gt;# next_D = sum(last N Ds) * T / [max(last N TSs) - min(last N TSs]; &lt;br/&gt;# ST= Solvetime, TS = timestamp &lt;br/&gt;&lt;br/&gt;# set constants until next hard fork: &lt;br/&gt;&lt;br/&gt;T=600; # coin&amp;#39;s TargetSolvetime &lt;br/&gt;N=30; # Averaging window. Smoother than N=15, faster response than N=60. &lt;br/&gt;X=5; &lt;br/&gt;limit = X^(2/N); # limit rise and fall in case of timestamp manipulation &lt;br/&gt;adjust = 1/(1&#43;0.67/N);  # keeps avg solvetime on track &lt;br/&gt;&lt;br/&gt;# begin difficulty algorithm &lt;br/&gt;&lt;br/&gt;avg_ST=0; avg_D=0; &lt;br/&gt;for ( i=height;  i &amp;gt; height-N;  i--) {  # go through N most recent blocks &lt;br/&gt;avg_ST &#43;= (TS[i] - TS[i-1]) / N; &lt;br/&gt;avg_D &#43;= D[i]/N; &lt;br/&gt;} &lt;br/&gt;avg_ST = T*limit if avg_ST &amp;gt; T*limit; &lt;br/&gt;avg_ST = T/limit if avg_ST &amp;lt; T/limit; &lt;br/&gt;&lt;br/&gt;next_D = avg_D * T / avg_ST * adjust; &lt;br/&gt;&lt;br/&gt;# Tim Olsen suggested changing reward to protect against hash attacks. &lt;br/&gt;# Karbowanek coin suggested something similar. &lt;br/&gt;# I could not find anything better than the simplest idea below. &lt;br/&gt;# It was a great surprise that coin issuance rate came out perfect. &lt;br/&gt;# BaseReward = coins per block &lt;br/&gt;&lt;br/&gt;next_reward = BaseReward * avg_ST / T; &lt;br/&gt;&lt;br/&gt;======= end algo ==== &lt;br/&gt;&lt;br/&gt;Due to the limit and keeping negative solvetimes in a true average, &lt;br/&gt;timestamp errors resulting in negative solvetimes are corrected in the next &lt;br/&gt;block. Otherwise, one would need to do like Zcash and cause a 5-block &lt;br/&gt;delay in the response by resorting to the median of past 11 blocks (MPT) &lt;br/&gt;as the most recent timestamp, offsetting the timestamps from their &lt;br/&gt;corresponding difficulties by 5 blocks. (it does not cause an averaging &lt;br/&gt;problem, but it does cause a 5-block delay in the response.)
    </content>
    <updated>2023-06-07T18:06:53Z</updated>
  </entry>

</feed>